Scottish Elises

Took my VX to Forrestburn on Sunday.

Having set a (albeit slow) personal best in my MX-5 on Saturday, I had high hopes of going a bit faster.

It wasn't to be. I did almost exactly the same times on Sunday as Saturday. VX felt fine but I couldn't bring myself to push an carry speed through the corners. I also had to spend a lot of conscious energy on the mechanics of driving the car. I think I am so conditioned to how far I can push my MX-5 that it will take a lot of tracktime to break the cycle.

Does anyone have experience of moving to a quicker car after an extended period in a slow car? I think I need some lessons and a few track days under my belt.

Still, I had a good time.
.

You need to take the car to an airfield where you can lose control of the car at high speed and gain confidence in your ability to (a) see it coming, (b) respond to it.

Trackdays are part of the solution of course, as are fast-ish road runs - the more you drive it, the more natural everything will seem.

I have the same problem in high speed corners - I'll happily push the car to the very edge in slower speed stuff, knowing that I'll most likely sort it out should there be less grip than I had hoped for - but in high speed corners, I cannot (easily) persuade myself to push the car to its limits as I just don't have the confidence that I'll catch it should it all go wrong. For my next walshy day I was planning on concentrating on higher speed cornering, losing control and learning to fix it.

Of course for hillclimbing you don't actually want to be driving like that, but unless you have the confidence to sort it out, you won't push it I think! (I'm assuming good times are achieved by committed but smooth driving, with only a small amount of brute force required).

Talking of pushing it, I was very impressed with what I saw of Alonso's driving this weekend - he was pushing that car very hard and losing it/recovering it in some really tricky situations when he pushed too hard. He deserved to do better and it was a shame that his car let him down (albeit after a bit of a donkey punch on the first corner). I wish I could drive like that (too fat to actually get in one, though !

Cheers,
Robin

P.S. there is the odd track where you can try some of this safely - e.g. the first big corner at Anglesey will generally let you away with it, but the trackday organisers probably get pissed off with you after a while, eh Neil?

Have been thinking about doing a few hill climbs/sprints in my S1, don't expect to be competitive, just for a bit of fun.

What sort of cost are involved in entering? Do you need a race suit etc? I take it you need to register some where to enter?

TIA

Edit; found the answers http://www.scottishelises.com/phpbb/vie ... &sk=t&sd=a

Mike Scib wrote:Have been thinking about doing a few hill climbs/sprints in my S1, don't expect to be competitive, just for a bit of fun.

What sort of cost are involved in entering? Do you need a race suit etc? I take it you need to register some where to enter?

TIA

I think you'd do aaarrrllllreeeet.
Helmet, suit, timing strut and you're away...
http://www.scottish-sprinting.co.uk/begin.html

Cost are minimal (much less than a trackday).

As Robin said, need to be comfortable and confident to push right up to the limit - sometimes you only find the limit by going beyond it...
(that's why I think Mike will do fine, that and his lack of imagination).

Cheers for the link Ali. Also need a Non Race National B then?

alicrozier wrote:As Robin said, need to be comfortable and confident to push right up to the limit - sometimes you only find the limit by going beyond it...
(that's why I think Mike will do fine, that and his lack of imagination).

"lack of imagination" sorry lost me

Probably getting a little bit ahead of my self here considering i have never even been to watch. Have Done a couple of sprints at Ingliston however.

Kev, I have been through the whole gambit of upgrading over the past ten years, starting with 118hp, then 180, 190, 220 and 300. However I was fortunate in discovering trackdays as soon as I got the car, especially Knockhill, and also road runs starting with the Scoobys on the Tour d'Ecosse. I also had instruction at KH from the start which made a big difference, and then discovered Walshy when he started up, so more professional instruction both on the road and the track.

There is no short cut to driving quickly and safely, it comes with experience and instruction. And there is no substitute for getting on track and learning your cars limits in a safe environment. With some of that under your belt, your VX will leave the MX5 trailing.

tut

Mike Scib wrote: "lack of imagination" sorry lost me

Imagination = 'Oh, there's a big tree...we're going sideways...I could die!'

Lack of imagination = prime requisite for going fast




yup on the licence - just a paperwork excercise...

Was paxing the ring really that bad Ali? Ave-eet!!

Was watching a couple of runs there, how good does Forrestburn look However not so sure about Doune, my "Imagination" was definitely working

Sure there will be a few more questions

alicrozier wrote:sometimes you only find the limit by going beyond it...

Isn't that what I have always said Mike? Well that's my excuse anyway and sticking to it

Remember the power of the "dont give a f*ck" factor is worth a lot, when flying up hills, round tracks etc.

With Robin totally on this, you need some time working out the VX, when it will go, and how it feels on the edge of departure

A Walshy or airfield day will help, as will trackdays where there is run off.

On the plus side, if you are being "precious" with it, then there's clearly more to come, and you've matched the MX5 without giving it 100%, so dont be too hard on yourself

I know we have a few hill climbers / sprinters on here, who will correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't really get it. I have looked a hill climbing or sprinting in the past, and can't get beyond the mental block of paying £80-£100 for four or five sub one minute runs. Or to put it another way, spending £20 per minute.

If you are not planning on being competitive, there are plenty of other places to spend your money on going fast on track, where you'll get far more miles / minutes to the £. If you are planning on being competitive, as far as I can see, you'll need to throw heaps of cash at the car, to stand a chance in any given class. In which case, it's no longer cheap motorsport, and you may as well go circuit racing or rallying instead, where you'll get some decent amount of track time. IMHO.

I have been to a few hill climbs and sprint tracks, and had quite a few drives on them (including forrestburn), and have really enjoyed finding the best line / limits etc in the tight confinds of the track. But this was always at non-competitive events (like fun nights / track days), and as far as I can see, is the best way to enjoy these tracks. A couple of years ago I went to a few forrestburn club nights, paid £10, and managed about a dozen runs up the hill. I did not have a competitive car, and just wanted a go, so that seemed to me the best solution.

My 2p

£ v minutes, its cheaper racing in the LOT then sprint/hillclimb's

Is there such a thing as cheap motorsport IF you are going to compete?

Scotty C

Scotty C wrote:£ v minutes, its cheaper racing in the LOT then sprint/hillclimb's

Is there such a thing as cheap motorsport IF you are going to compete?

Scotty C

Other than the obvious stuff like Autotests, Trials and road rallies, I think there is such a think as cheap motorsport. I have a few pals who compete in tarmac rallies and get a lot more for their £ than elsewhere. I have had several 'pub chats' with folk, and reckon for a the cost of a few sprints, you could do the occassional race. Which option is better?.. that can be left for another pub chat. As I say, I don't quite get it, but those who have competed at sprints etc can maybe enlighten me.

Thanks for your wise words. I wasn't really down on myself - I just naively expected to be quicker in the VX out the box.

Dominic, its simple. I love the buzz of beating the clock. When I'm not competitive against others, I compete against myself. I've done loads of trackdays over the last 10 years and I stopped enjoying them as soon as I started doing competitive stuff. For me, it's not the thrill of going fast or the tracktime, its the need to beat either myself or others.

For me, a grand day out has four elements (in order of importance):
1. to win the class
2. to go faster than I've been before at that circuit,
3. to get faster on each successive run
4. to do my fastest run on my last run

If I can get three out of four, I'm fairly happy (I rarely win the class).

Finally, I do relate very much to Ali's 'lack of imagination' comment. Unfortunately, I don't have that - especially at Forrestburn. The photo below was me last year after someone convinced me I could take the first corner flat. I still haven't quite got over it. For the 10 seconds or so that it took me to bounce to the lochside, the only thing going through my mind was "how am I going to tell the wife". My imagination of what she was going to do to me if I pranged the car was running wild I really should have been thinking about how I was going to get out of the car if I went through that fence.