SLS Round 4 - whos in

[TrackScotland]

That's round 4 entry forms available - http://superlapscotland.co.uk/docs/SLS_Round4_ENTRY.pdf

http://superlapscotland.co.uk/entry.htm

Facebook page - https://www.facebook.com/SuperlapScotland

There were a couple of SE'ers at rounds 2 and 3

[Gourlay83]

76% at the moment Addam or Fee.

Hopefully more of the N/A light cars turn up (shame on you all ), as 'competing' against 650bhp race cars ain't much fun.

See if I can improve my lap timings.

Alan

[Scotty C]

alan fit one of these

just change the bottom line to, "for final use only"

[Gourlay83]

alan fit one of these

just change the bottom line to, "for final use only"

They're already in use

[TrackScotland]

It's Adam

I will be at this one... in B, but possibly the very very bottom of B. 1220kg and about 380whp = 308bhp/tonne

Each 'type' of car has its benefits too. High power 4wd has great grip but suffers through its weight.... light weight nimble cars (like the caterhams) can keep on the power for much longer.

For next year we need to get with KMSC to work on classes (regs seem set by MSA :s ) that may attract more lower powered cars.... the classes do exist just now (E but not enough cars that low down to warrant using it), but I think 100bhp/ton is quite a big margin. Obviously too many classes with too few cars isnt going to happen, so it needs to be sensible


I'll make a topic on TS soon to open up some discussion.

[Scottish Scrutineer]

I know I've said this before, but consider aligning the classes with those used in the Scottish Speed Championship. That may attract others from the regular Sprints and Hills and liven the classes up.


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Renny

[Mikie711]

I know I've said this before, but consider aligning the classes with those used in the Scottish Speed Championship. That may attract others from the regular Sprints and Hills and liven the classes up.


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Renny

What he said . Power to weight will only work if everybody is using list 1A/1B tyres and are road cars. You can't run sports libre and road cars side by side.

[Gourlay83]

It's Adam

I will be at this one... in B, but possibly the very very bottom of B. 1220kg and about 380whp = 308bhp/tonne

Each 'type' of car has its benefits too. High power 4wd has great grip but suffers through its weight.... light weight nimble cars (like the caterhams) can keep on the power for much longer.

That's the way it should be IMHO, turn up in the car as is/the way you like it and have a go. I don't understand what people get out of entering a car that's been tweeked to achieve the limit of a class to beat a bunch of track day enthusiasts. If you're taking things that seriously and spending that much money - Go Racing.

Your second point is correct, but to a point. A Caterham will generally beat the big 4x4's but only so far, when you're competing against basically race cars with 3 (possibly 4) times the bhp there isn't much I can do.

However, i'm not complaining. I really enjoyed the practice sessions against the clock, great to see what times I can actually do and how I can improve on things. I will be there at the next one racing against my previous time, trying to improve my driving and set-up.

I only had two minor issues, the class structure is too wide - big difference between 300bhp and 400bhp but not much you can do until the numbers improve.

The second was the 'Turn the boost to 11' for the final, I was setting consistent times all day long and sitting first in class (2nd overall). Then the power brigade turn up the boost in the finals.... probably to save engines but what stops them doing a dyno run to get 400bhp/tonne then have a button on the steering wheel to open the waste gate and achieve maximum ooft. I'll stick my neck out and say there was one car in particular that was very special, well driven no doubt but must be very close to the class limit.

Really enjoyed it all the same, glad David was there as we had a blast and hope to see more N/A light cars on track

Alan

[TrackScotland]

Can someone explain how the Sprint/Hills classes would work, and why they would improve things? From my limited knowledge there seem to be too many to make it work, and one thing to remember is I think KH are trying to implement something like TimeAttack, not another sprint. Scotland has a Sprint series, and Hill Climb series... they have no Time Attack style events other than SLS.

Boost - there is nothing to stop people turning up boost, and most... if not all folks with turbos will do this. Use the practice sessions to get a feel for things/setup. Qualy and final - point scoring so times count. The dyno runs are taken at full boost. I know and trust the two dyno operators that seem to do most of the power runs, and they are quite open on the matter of other folks power, and potential. Its easy to see a cars potential power from its spec too

Alan Freeland is a tough one... my gut feeling was he should be A, but after hearing more deatils and info on its power it just fits into B, but is at the very top end. The car is a road car thats been turned into a track/race car, it still runs the standard fuel tank for example. I think Alan is just damn fast too. Saying that... every class winner will raise a question on its power. Bob in C for example.

And..... another point to consider. Roddie that was supposed to be doing SLS (I think he cocked his entry form up and meant to do the saloons all along) was doing 53sec laps. He would have been in B in SLS, in a Caterham.

Agreed - the banding needs reduced as 100bhp is too much.

[TrackScotland]

done a bit of googling.... how on earth would this number of classes work with the realistic no'd for SLS????

Division A - Road Cars
A1 Saloon Cars up to 1400cc
A2 Saloon Cars over 1400cc and up to 2000cc
A3 Saloon Cars over 2000cc
A4 Sports Cars up to 1400cc
A5 Sports Cars over 1400cc and up to 1700cc
A6 Sports Cars over 1700cc
A7 Classic and Thoroughbred Cars (period defined)
A8 Marque Road Sports Cars

Division B - Modified Cars
B1 Modified Saloon Cars up to 1400cc
B2 Modified Saloon Cars over 1400cc and up to 2000cc
B3 Modified Saloon Cars over 2000cc
B4 Modified Sports Cars up to 1400cc
B5 Modified Sports Cars over 1400cc and up to 1700cc
B6 Modified Sports Cars over 1700cc

Division C - Competition Cars
C0 Saloon Libre
C1 Sports Libre Cars up to 1400cc
C2 Sports Libre Cars over 1400cc and up to 1800cc
C3 Sports Libre Cars over 1800cc
C4 Racing Cars up to 1100cc
C5 Racing Cars over 1100cc and up to 1600cc
C6 Racing Cars over 1600cc

[TrackScotland]

I know I've said this before, but consider aligning the classes with those used in the Scottish Speed Championship. That may attract others from the regular Sprints and Hills and liven the classes up.


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Renny

What he said . Power to weight will only work if everybody is using list 1A/1B tyres and are road cars. You can't run sports libre and road cars side by side.

Only 1 car in the series is not a true road car..... or built from a road car (including specialist).

ALL run MSA 1B/1A tyres, regardless of class.

The other cars are coming in through Sports Libre to meet the MSA's strange rules on engine changes for example. Fee was Sports Libre because she opted to run with a non-standard rear wing... thats all. She still drove a production based saloon car on 1B tyres, like those in entering under Modified. Sports Libre is a definition that seems to cover many cars - not all being crazy purpose built mega-money cars. One of the main issues 'Joe Bloggs' has with the series is their displeasure at having to de-tune/down grade their car to meet the regs. All they want to do it go fast LOL and dont understand production/modified/libre.

Tut would need to enter through Sport Libre for example!

[Gourlay83]

And..... another point to consider. Roddie that was supposed to be doing SLS (I think he cocked his entry form up and meant to do the saloons all along) was doing 53sec laps. He would have been in B in SLS, in a Caterham.

Agreed - the banding needs reduced as 100bhp is too much.

Had a chat with him, really nice guy. 2.3 Duratec on Slicks so would really expect 53s laps

[David]

And..... another point to consider. Roddie that was supposed to be doing SLS (I think he cocked his entry form up and meant to do the saloons all along) was doing 53sec laps. He would have been in B in SLS, in a Caterham.

Agreed - the banding needs reduced as 100bhp is too much.

Had a chat with him, really nice guy. 2.3 Duratec on Slicks so would really expect 53s laps

And if he was reving it to 9500, as he said , then you're looking at least 450-500 WHP/tonne

On a general note:

I've been slagged off here before when I was expressing concerns about power-to-weight classification as the heavier cars do make up more on the straights than they loose on the corners - I think Alan found that out too, but I'm a little more comfortable with structure as the rounds have progressed. Mainly because a championship needs a car to score points reliably. The high BHP cars do run a higher risk of not making it through the year, so that evens it out a bit. I'll be back for round 4, but having secured 2nd place in class B, I may run in class C (with ballast) to compete with similar paced cars as the top B class car is running 4 seconds quicker than anything I could realistically achieve.

[TrackScotland]

thats my general take on the classes.... they are nearly there just some tweaks. The banding needs reduced, and shifted.

50bhp bands would prob be ideal but would give too many classes..


The upper class (A) is always going to have bonkers cars, or cars that have the potential to be quick... so the 400bhp/tonne seems to be a roughly correct margin.

On paper - Fee's old GTR was around 385bhp/tonne and should have been in B - doing 55sec laps on 1B tyres... so maybe lowering the headline class to 375+ ???

Thoughts?

A: 375+
B: 310-375
C: 250-310
D: 185-250
E: <185

giving 65bhp margin for B and D, 60bhp for C. E low enough for 'normal' cars, A high enough to catch more bonkers cars?

[Mikie711]

Adam, your not going to change the regs mid season but that looks a lot better. By the end of the year you will have a better idea based on times for the various classes but certainly tighter classes should make things more even.