Friggin Cyclists

[Kinger]

I am firmly in the 'frighten cyclist' camp I was left with permanent shoulder disability after a cyclist pulled out on me on my motorbike in 2014.
To be fair his 2 colleagues confirmed to Police that he was totally to blame and he was subsequently charged with Dangerous cycling. He had no memory of the accident and although injured made a full recovery. My injuries were more serious despite having full protective gear vs his Lycra
Thankfully I eventually got a settlement as he had insurance through his cycle club but it looked for a long time like I was going to be left high and dry.
So in my opinion icyclists should be required to have public liability insurance if they are going to cycle on the roads.

I agree, why shouldn't they ?

[Doc883]

In my opinion icyclists should be required to have public liability insurance if they are going to cycle on the roads.

I agree, why shouldn't they ?

Also agree ref public liability insurance and we push all riders in our Club to take out British Cycling membership for that very purpose. I suppose on the flipside there are circa 2 million vehicles on the road with No insurance also.
It sounds like the incident did involve the group I was cycling with as we travelled the Whang from Harburn to Balerno but we had no idea this incident occured until reading this thread.
The current generation of bike lights and most of the cheap Chinese Cree sets are super bright and if set to strobe can be a problem to oncoming traffic. I suppose in defence of the riders the number of obstacles and pot-holes on our roads which can be life changing if hit at speed have dictated the need for overly bright lights. Also older cars have annual MOT tests where headlight adjustment is checked/corrected and a lot of new cars have auto-levelling or smart lights to prevent blinding oncoming traffic. On a bike it's not so easy to adjust the beam to both light the road ahead whilst at the same time not have the potential to affect oncoming traffic.
I'll be at the Club tomorrow so will certainly raise this as a point of action that we avoid the use of strobe on the front lights.

[douglasgdmw]

Doc,

The roads are getting worse on the Lang Wang, thats mostly due to the A71 road closure and the 'tarmac' trucks using that route and churning up the road. Its bad enough on a car so I can imagine the damage it can cause on a road bike.

Thanks for mentioning it at the club, much appreciated and goes to show that your club considers other road users as well.

That offer of "isotonic" refreshments is definitely open for your club at our house

George

[kerryxeg]

I came across some local cyclists on a regular night run on our single track road. They's stopped at the top of the hill and were unaware that their lights were blinding. They were also unaware that by blinding the cars they were also putting themselves in danger, because I couldn't see their mate who was relieving himself on the other side of the road!

As a cyclist I understand the need for a decent light, but consideration is required both ways, if only so the cyclists don't endanger themselves by distracting the other road users.

[pshanks76]

As a driver and a cyclist I've been on the receiving end of idiocy from both camps. I think it's pretty safe to say that there are good and bad both sides, and we can't label an entire group based on the actions of the odd few.

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[pete]

I agree, why shouldn't they ?

Should pedestrians too?

U18s?

How are you going to enforce it?



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[kenny]

I agree, why shouldn't they ?

What difference will it make?

As a cyclist I am not going to start thinking I had better be careful now to avoid an expensive insurance claim. I am already thinking I had better be carefule because if I get into a fight with a car I am probably going to lose. But, hey, if you get some cyclists brains splattered down your car at least you can claim a free valet off his insurance. Nice one.

[ClarkyBoy]

I am firmly in the 'friggin cyclist' camp I was left with permanent shoulder disability after a cyclist pulled out on me on my motorbike in 2014.
To be fair his 2 colleagues confirmed to Police that he was totally to blame and he was subsequently charged with Dangerous cycling. He had no memory of the accident and although injured made a full recovery. My injuries were more serious despite having full protective gear vs his Lycra
Thankfully I eventually got a settlement as he had insurance through his cycle club but it looked for a long time like I was going to be left high and dry.
So in my opinion icyclists should be required to have public liability insurance if they are going to cycle on the roads.

Utter Bollox IMO.

I was left with permanent disabilities (both legs, and my right shoulder along with plenty other issues as a result) following a non-fault motorbike accident in may 2014. (Dutch tourist on the wrong side of the road)

My claim is still on going and not settled - admission of liability confirmed at the time, then backed up some time after officially by the 3rd party's insurer.

Grant yourself lucky that yours has been settled already and be aware that had that been a car that hit you then you probably would still be waiting for their insurer to go to court.

Also - if you been left with a permanent disability then what difference does it make whether it was a cyclist, insured or otherwise? the fact oft her matter is that if it was the person on the bike's fault then they would be just as likely to make the same error regardless of what their mode of transport.

With regards to the OP.

As others have said - a driver should be aware of their surroundings (you have already said its a popular route) and be prepared to deal with any eventuality.

What if it had been a herd of sheep ?

Would you have been on here ranting about how sheep should get off the road ?

I think that poor road sense is not exclusive to cyclists so see no need for a blanket statement about 'how cyclists are bad road users' , on my commute I see it from cars, lorrys, busses, bikes and basically anything else you've ever seen on the road.

Its not the mode of transport that's generally the problem - Its the person in control of it that's generally the issue (or not in control)

[j2 lot]

Clark, Not sure what part of my post you consider to be utter bollox - Am I missing something or are you questioning my honesty on this I have war and peace in paperwork including settlement details if you need proof?

[douglasgdmw]

With regards to the OP.

As others have said - a driver should be aware of their surroundings (you have already said its a popular route) and be prepared to deal with any eventuality.

What if it had been a herd of sheep ?

Would you have been on here ranting about how sheep should get off the road ?

I think that poor road sense is not exclusive to cyclists so see no need for a blanket statement about 'how cyclists are bad road users' , on my commute I see it from cars, lorrys, busses, bikes and basically anything else you've ever seen on the road.

Its not the mode of transport that's generally the problem - Its the person in control of it that's generally the issue (or not in control)

Admittedly I have had a rant (and if you look at all my previous post history I don't think I have often had a rant before) however I was a little bit annoyed with my wife coming in distressed that she nearly crashed the car due to being dazzled by oncoming traffic (who happened to be cyclists). The same rant may have been posted had it been a car driver, lorry driver or motorbike etc.

Thankfully one of the S.Elise'r was in the that group and can see if from the other peoples point of view, it was not deliberate and hopefully some more cyclists will be more aware of the impact of flashing bike led's with respect to oncoming traffic.

Regarding the sheep question, of course I would not be coming on here complaining about sheep being in the road. However the difference is that people have the ability to make conscious decisions.

George

[jason]

Yet another cyclist here...

I agree about the lights issue. I often have to stop the car when dazzled by oncoming cyclists' flashing or solid lights on our local lanes. Sometimes only needs to be one bike if the lamp isn't considerately angled down at the road. While bike lights have become more powerful (I love modern power for MTB hoonery, Strathpuffer, etc - though even then battery life needs win over trail-melting brightness) I struggle with the defence that xxx lumens are 'needed' for potholes and the like. How on earth did we ever survive country lane winter night rides in the 80s/90s with our feeble Ever Ready lamps?? I run my lamp angled down and on lowest power (<200 lumen) when there's facing road users - it's still plenty to see the road surface and to be seen without dazzling others, even for winter night solo centuries.

Of course, there are also times I have to stop cycling cos a thoughtless (or selfish) driver is blinding me with their unnecessarily bright Xenon headlamps on full beam....

Won't add to the blind brow replies (which I agree with). It's all been said

[douglasgdmw]

Yes I can see everyone's comment about the top of the brow.

What I did not explain is that at the top of the brow of the hill on the Lang Wang you get a lovely outlook on the reserviour and pentland hills. The majority of the cyclists stop there as its a fairly long ascent and their legs must be burning.

As we know the road we are aware that cyclists stop there, but sometimes they are 2 or 3 wide enjoying the view. The concern I have is that they are putting themselves in mortal danger as the majority of cars are not expecting static cyclists on a blind brow. There is a verge on the side of the road that would be a lot safer for them to rest their legs on and put them in less danger.

My point is that its a major road, I have walked along some of it so I know how scary it is with traffic travelling at a reasonable speed very close to you (and often trucks as well).

The responsibility is on the car driver to expect the unexpected but sometimes common sense should also come into it.

I have had to pull cars out of ditches on that road before and the last thing I would want is for fatalities to occur on the road (be it cars or cyclists).

Maybe that part of the rant was ill explained but wanted to vent some anger about how cyclists were putting themselves in danger when it could be avoided.

[woody]

Yet another cyclist here...

I agree about the lights issue. I often have to stop the car when dazzled by oncoming cyclists' flashing or solid lights on our local lanes. Sometimes only needs to be one bike if the lamp isn't considerately angled down at the road. While bike lights have become more powerful (I love modern power for MTB hoonery, Strathpuffer, etc - though even then battery life needs win over trail-melting brightness) I struggle with the defence that xxx lumens are 'needed' for potholes and the like. How on earth did we ever survive country lane winter night rides in the 80s/90s with our feeble Ever Ready lamps?? I run my lamp angled down and on lowest power (<200 lumen) when there's facing road users - it's still plenty to see the road surface and to be seen without dazzling others, even for winter night solo centuries.

Of course, there are also times I have to stop cycling cos a thoughtless (or selfish) driver is blinding me with their unnecessarily bright Xenon headlamps on full beam....

Won't add to the blind brow replies (which I agree with). It's all been said

Agree with most of this (the ever ready's were so poor i think we used it's once) and cant stand flashing fun lights either when I'm on the bike or in the car.

I would add I've been blinded more times on the bike by drivers who don't seem to realise they need to dip their headlights for cyclists as well as cars than i have by cyclists in the car.

As with everything, singling out one group and tarring all within it serves no one any favours be it cyclists, motorbikers, taxi drivers or even sportscar owners.

[Doc883]

Yet another cyclist here...
I struggle with the defence that xxx lumens are 'needed' for potholes and the like. How on earth did we ever survive country lane winter night rides in the 80s/90s with our feeble Ever Ready lamps??

We used to 'survive' the 80's driving cars whose headlights put out about 5watts but that hasn't stopped the march to ever brighter car lights be it Xenon, LED or even fecking Lasers
I ride almost exclusively in groups with our club including night rides throughout the winter. It's a huge responsibility when your on the front of a group to identify and point out road hazards to those behind you.
A pothole is an inconvenience to cars but for cyclists it's a major issue. I'd much prefer to see 20-30m ahead of me and it's not always possible to alter the strength of a bike light when met by an oncoming car on the crest of a hill.

[Jam_s160]

Bring back the dynamo lights from the early eighties you know the ones you flick to connect to the wheels (sometimes trapping those kiddy fingers). Speed dependant so just slow down to dip and safety at its best = stop and the lights go out