Government buying Prestwick

[scott_e]

it's the only choice this side of America for really big & military traffic. On a course, more later.

Thats interesting , would like to know more when you have 5.

Reminds me of an A400 article i was reading. Can the C17 land at Prestwick ?

A400 can use "roughly prepared" airfield so it will have no problem with 1000s of broken bottles of Buckfast

[j2 lot]

Can the C17 land at Prestwick ?

They have used Prestwick before, there was amateur film of it IIRC

Edit to add: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuMKTAaNUYo

Strictly speaking that doesnt answer your question as its taking off.............

[woody]

I did wonder if it'd been closed or sold yesterday when I spotted a TV van in the car park on the way home.

I *think* I've seen C17's in quite a few times, it's either them or C5 galaxy's. IIRC it's one of the longest civil runways in Europe. Any time there's something kicking off with US involvement, the airport seems a lot busier with military traffic. There's often fast jets through but mainly C130/Hercs. It's also the airport used for any terrorist incident; there's a hatch by St Cuthberts Golf course the aircraft are instructed to park over that the special forces can access from afar via a tunnel.

I stay 5.5 miles from the airport and it's another mile to work, slotted between the 2 runways, so it's handy for me. I often get the train to Glasgow if I've cycled in as the GF lives there. I can't honestly say that it's easier to go from Glasgow Abbotsinch than Glasgow Prestwick from the west of the city; I hate paying for parking and buses, so the public transport is more of a hassle to Abbotsinch from the West End in our experience. I can't see the point saying it's not handy from Dundee, that much is obvious (despite the road being a mix of Mway and dual all the way). Leaving from Ayrshire, Edinburgh isn't exactly handy either. Dom, I thought you were in Kirkie East of Glasgow btw?

From a business POV, I'm not sure we really make use of the airport. Our inbound and outbound goods almost always go by road. However for other aerospace businesses nearby I'd assume it to be vital; the Boeing Dreamlifter (for 787 parts) is in often and occasionally the EADS Beluga. Additionally, many airlines use it for pilot training bump & go loops (where I assume the relative quietness is a bonus). Thompson have had 787s up recently. As above, there are often Antanov 124's in and very occasionally the 224. CargoLux fly in several times a week with their new 747-8's and AirFrance Cargo use it among others. Think they've lost Atlas & Evergreen over the past few years though.

I can only really offer anecdotal evidence, but Pete & Mrs Pete will have a much better idea of everything that goes on there. Oh, and guess what happens when Abbotsinch & Edinburgh are fogged or snowed out, Prestwick is open almost always. It's far, far from perfect, but as a regional airport is both much larger than usual (with the associated overheads) and much more important to the local economy (I'm thinking compered to say Bournemouth or Cardiff etc..). That said, I'm not entirely comfortable with the Scottish Government buying it, especially their motivation to do so this year.

They do, badly, need a new slogan though.

[robin]

I don't see why we shouldn't keep it open as a freight/military airport with no (commercial) passenger handling facilities. I would guess that would reduce staff by 90%. Mothball the passenger terminal until the market comes back (if it ever does).

If it cannot be run at a profit as a freight handling airport, close it 3-5 years from now. If the world's military would like to pay to keep it open, let them do so.

I suspect air freight is a growing business, so there should be a market for it.

Spend more money (including that not spent on employing 1,300 people you don't really need) on improving the road/rail link to the airport for improved freight handling.

Cheers,
Robin

[j2 lot]

N'ah close it so we have a new Motorsport venue

[woody]

Passenger numers have dropped for 2.4 million to 1.1 million in the last 5 years.
We have used Prestwick once and despite it being closer to our house than Glasgow it's a pain in the ar$e to use because theres no decent infrastructure or transport links.
I believe its also the British airport of choice to direct terrorist inflicted flights as it has large enough runways and is fairly remote if it does get blown to buggery

I don't want to be too defensive towards the place, but I can't see how the infrastructure near Prestwick is worse than Glasgow? One's off the M8, one's off the A/M77 and a railway line. It's maybe the roads at your end make Glasgow easier?

Only if you're not on the coyurse or in the houses next to where the planes are parked in the event of an incident. The last time there was an event the houses & course were evacuated.

[woody]

I don't see why we shouldn't keep it open as a freight/military airport with no (commercial) passenger handling facilities. I would guess that would reduce staff by 90%. Mothball the passenger terminal until the market comes back (if it ever does).

If it cannot be run at a profit as a freight handling airport, close it 3-5 years from now. If the world's military would like to pay to keep it open, let them do so.

I suspect air freight is a growing business, so there should be a market for it.

Spend more money (including that not spent on employing 1,300 people you don't really need) on improving the road/rail link to the airport for improved freight handling.

Cheers,
Robin

As above, I can't see the problem with the roads around the airport. To be honest, it's ideal for Northern Ireland as well. There's a fuel dump & pipeline on the railway, but given Royal Prestwick , Royal Troon & the coast, they'd have a job getting in a freight handling area for rail unless they can use some carpark space.

Freight is, or was down quite a bit as well, but not sure how that's headed just now. Internationally though, I'd not be entirely confident it's growing.

I suspect the 2M a year loss the BBC quote is seen by the government as an offset to what the cost of the impact on the area would be. With the aerospace industry declining in the face of a closed airport they'd stand to loose several thousand of the most reasonably paid people in the area; it's probably Ayrshire's last remaining industry/USP.

[j2 lot]

[I don't want to be too defensive towards the place, but I can't see how the infrastructure near Prestwick is worse than Glasgow? One's off the M8, one's off the A/M77 and a railway line. It's maybe the roads at your end make Glasgow easier?

Ok, not so much the roads infrastructure as the transport links. I used it, when it was at its peak passenger numbers, to go to Germany and couldnt find anyway to get there by public transport without going to Glasgow and getting the train back and the timings ,for what were mostly early morning and late evening flights, meant there were no through travel options once you got back to Weeg, gave up and arranged a lift in the end but it did detract from the cheap flight option.

Dont get me wrong I would be happy to use it and hope it stays open but it needs investment and some joined up thinking to make it a more attractive option to use

[sendmyusername]

If it is only (only) losing £2m a year, and they can peg it at that, I think keeping it open is the best option, considering how much they squander on nonsensical schemes, £2m to keep an industrial hub is more important, not just for the area, but for scotland too.
I agree about maybe scrapping the passenger flights, and focusing and promoting the freight.
IF we get independance, i'd hope that the government would be pushing industry, and that would be harder to do without a dedicated freight airport.

Similar to remploy, I think it makes more sense maintaining a minor-lose-making business that has lots of employees better all round than laying them all off and forcing them onto benefits, even if it is only a shortish term sollution. It costs more to the government for unemployed than working at a (slight) loss

[Doc883]

Are we entering a situation where tax payers money is effectively subsidising Ryanair Operations

[Lazydonkey]

I can't honestly say that it's easier to go from Glasgow Abbotsinch than Glasgow Prestwick from the west of the city; I hate paying for parking and buses, so the public transport is more of a hassle to Abbotsinch from the West End in our experience.

Course it is - £20 in a taxi from the west end, a fair bit more than that to Prestwick

As i said earlier the Ryanair flight i wanted to get lands after the last train from prestwick....so you're only option is to drive...and then pay for parking at the airport. There may be no railway station at GLA but there is at least a 24 hour bus. That alone kills Prestwick for me and it's worse for those not living in the city.

[woody]

Are we entering a situation where tax payers money is effectively subsidising Ryanair Operations

Depends if that's the spin you want to see. You can't blame Ryanair for being the only operator there.

Donkey, it was £26 to the west end last time. Fine for us, but not so fine for my teenage cousins who were over in the summer.

[Lazydonkey]

Maybe not but my point is that Prestwick would be more in a taxi or £16 odd per couple for a train that doesn't run when the planes land.

[Andy G]

There's a reason they couldnt find a buyer - an Airport with only one customer (and a bugger of a customer at that - Ryanair) with only 27 routes is stuffed.

The only way to make the airport commercially viable is to get the number of operators back up rapidly.

Realistically though, given the population, I doubt theres much sense operationally for having another option rather than Glasgow ??

I could be wrong on this, but i heard most airports are actually only commercially viable by the extra revenue streams that they have open to them, i.e. shopping, food etc. Certainly a rumour i heard in the industry but unsubstantiated. If true though the tax payer will end up footing the bill from Prestwick till they close it.

Get your wallet out sir... IDEAL for ragging supercars up and down lol..........

I'd possibly pay £2 not the £2m being discussed - oh and i dont need 1300 staff either.

[robin]

Spend more money (including that not spent on employing 1,300 people you don't really need) on improving the road/rail link to the airport for improved freight handling.
Cheers,
Robin

As above, I can't see the problem with the roads around the airport.

Then don't spend the money ... I don't really care ... was just suggesting that as air freight is always part of a bigger logistics picture then if the next hop isn't in place the air freight won't come.