WTF have they done??!!? - updated

ninja · Post by **ninja** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:17 pm

ok i'm a chartered structural engineer so know bugger all about cars but i do know about structures and metalwork. the dressing up would not IMHO be acceptable as:

1 - it's a structural part of the chassis and any damage to this could cause a concentration of stress - say around a dent in the tray or around the gouges in the under tray. this is a very real structural failure mechanism called a stress fracture where the load is transferred through the material in a way that it wasn't designed to. you can get extremely high stress concentrations around holes in sheet metal and although the holes around the perimeter of the the plate will have been allowed for in the design a gouge or hole in the under tray anywhere else could cause a very real problem.

2 - similarly repairing the damage could cause a concentration of stress resulting in a structural failure.

3 - as a matter of principal it should be replaced - they damaged your car and should be expected to replace the damaged part without all this fcuking about!

w*nkers!!

where are they and we'll all park up and block their garage

ninja

Sanjøy · Post by **Sanjøy** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:18 pm

I klnow how you feel dude, you just want it sorted but... if you let them get away with it and then I dont know when you come to sell it turns out something is bent.

I would think about getting a legal letter draw stating the car needs to be inspected by a 3rd party while you have a hire car.

They have to learn.

ninja · Post by **ninja** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:25 pm

FYI when metal was first used to make boats a lot of them split in half and sank. it took a while to figure out why this was happening but it seems that under high winds the portholes acted as a stress concentration point, now this had been allowed for in the design but the rivet holes around the porthole hadn't been allowed for and stress fractures were found to eminate from these tiny little holes in the sheet metal, the fracture propigated and eventually split the boat in half sinking it.

so although dressing up may seem like a good and cheap way of fobbing you off i'd be very very pi55ed off if it were my car as the undertray is a stressed element helping to control the torsional stiffness of your car while you're throwing it about back roads. it could take 6 months for you to find the problem resulting from the gouges in the undertray and at that point it'll be too late to get them to fix it!

ninja

Scottd · Post by **Scottd** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:25 pm

Shug wrote:I think it's time you PM'ed Super Greg.... .

Yea I was talking to Greg about it, IIRC the next step if JM wont offer any more is to go thro my own insurance

(as yet another 'no fault' accident?!

).

ninja · Post by **ninja** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:28 pm

can you not email this to someone at lotus and get them to comment on the problem?

it would appear that you can indeed send a copy of this thread to lotus HQ. mmm wonder if they'll get back to me

ninja

Rich H · Post by **Rich H** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:30 pm

The undertray isn't a problem, annoying yes, but nothing more. The problem is the other scrapes on the chassis rails, I don't see how they can dress tem out at all.

Sanjøy · Post by **Sanjøy** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:32 pm

Send the pics to Wayne at sinclaires. They looked after my car and went the extra country mile EVERY TIME.

mac · Post by **mac** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:35 pm

Ninja - the undertray isn't a structual element in the elise - it can be used without it's fitment.

It's essentially a ladder frame making a box section with the engine hanging of the rear and the crash structure to the front.

IIRC the structural elements are a beam at the front, the one below you thighs and one at the rear.

Mac

ninja · Post by **ninja** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:40 pm

cool that's not so bad then!

sorry for the rant

my new radiator has arrived today

ninja

Post by **Shug** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:45 pm

mac wrote:Ninja - the undertray isn't a structual element in the elise - it can be used without it's fitment.

It's essentially a ladder frame making a box section with the engine hanging of the rear and the crash structure to the front.

IIRC the structural elements are a beam at the front, the one below you thighs and one at the rear.

Mac

To clarify Mac, the damage in the pic above is not one of the trays. It's the chassis next to the jacking point (note the fixings bonded in) That said, what you're saying *may* still apply, as it's not the extruded beam section that's scored, but the floor.

Still, they f**ked it, compensation is required.

ninja · Post by **ninja** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:51 pm

with any luck lotus will come back with a reply to set our minds at ease

ninja

mac · Post by **mac** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:02 pm

the cross beam that's glued and has the 3 screw fittings at either side? Where's the undertray locates along the long end???

If so then that is the rear structural element.

Scott - join the OLC (offical lotus club or whatever it's called) then fire off an e-mail to Nick Adams at the factory (it helps if you mention your a club memeber) along with the photos - ask him if he thinks it warrents an inspection from one of the technical engineers.

Mac

Post by **Shug** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:07 pm

mac wrote:the cross beam that's glued and has the 3 screw fittings at either side? Where's the undertray locates along the long end???

No, further forward if I'm seeing it right. Probably 4 or 5 inches forward of the beam join you're referring to (and that I indicated, with the jacking point reference) I can only see floor - but I might be reading it wrong...

And WTF should he have to pay to join an official club to get an answer for the factory?

mac · Post by **mac** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:08 pm

you don't it just smooths the passage.

mac

Rich H · Post by **Rich H** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:09 pm

mac wrote:you don't it just smooths the passage.
mac

Fnar fnar, the silicon lube is on the other thread...