The great gearbox debate ......

[kerryxeg]

DSG is a great tool, but I agree with the general view there is a time and a place.

My first DSG was in the S4, it made 300 odd hp feel more like 400+. Even on a 170 bhp diesel you get a lot of benefit.
However I just spent the day driving the old 911, a quirky G50 manual, it's a physical experience, but even the run to work is a joy.
Porsche say they can't put DSG in the Cayenne as they'd have to downrate the towing capacity. Press the sport button and it rattles through pretty effectively, much to the disgust of the dogs.

[Simon82]

I love the S-tronic in my RS4 as I use it as my daily and it just works. Does it work better than an "Old fashioned" slush box....well the fact that Audi have now gone away from the S-tronic in the latest RS4 would suggest probably not, but that could be from a cost/warranty point of view on their part.
S-tronic definitely not as smooth as a normal auto but it does work really well, especially on the paddles. There is no hesitation on the changes that you can get with some other autos.

As most have said though I wouldn't spec it on a toy car and probably wouldn't have specced it at the time on the RS in the first place if they had done a manual....which I'm now glad they didn't as I think the S-tronic suits the car really well.

[Victor Meldrew]

I had the option of a DSG thingy on the Mini Cooper, or a manual, price didn't have much in it.

I went for a manual because my old 1982? mini had a manual. E 820 JSR or Jesica as I called her. only had a 997cc engine but she screamed and pulled hard every time it was asked of her.

If you drive an auto you might as well buy her a dildo so she can do the work herself and you don't need to worry about the end result. If you drive a manual, the only way to get the best out of her is to do the hard work yourself.

Life lesson.....

[Mikie711]

Interesting comments and not really surprised by the consensus on here. From my own experience the DSG or S-tronic in the R8 made much more sense on track than on the road. On the road it was good, changed seamlessly but could be caught out from time to time in full auto and for sure day to day the ZF 8 speed in the RRS was smoother. If indulging in some spirited driving on road, which was hard to do due to the speed that car would do, it was better but in sport mode it held the gear to long.
On track however it came alive in manual mode and was very very good IMO. Surprised a few people as pax as well. Now I get the, manual adds to the driving experience thing but for me I prefer the DSG on track and a manual for fun on the road. And don't get me started on the steel v's carbon brakes debate

[Sanjøy]

PDK on a 16 plate Boxster was fun as was the PDK in the 718. When a good chunk of your time is spent in traffic or cities it makes sense. On the Glenshee run would I rather have the 911 in manual or PDK? I am pretty torn on that, it can do the job so well and probably faster than me in Sport+.

Agree on the ZFs, for luxo barges its a no brainer.

[Ferg]

I must be getting old but an Auto on a daily driver looks more and more attractive. I've only tried Double Clutch boxes a few times but each time I felt it was an odd half way house. Never owned an auto or any description, maybe I need to try.

[alicrozier]

New 7-speed DSG in the Golf R makes sense as a day to day runabout including stop and go town traffic. From the few runs I've had in it so far the auto modes are like it's GTi predecessor (and agree with what you say on the R8 Mike). Normal is fine for pootling but changes up too soon, you end up using more accelerator and it then kicks down... Sport mode holds the gears too long for anything other than flat out attack. What's needed is an in between mode that accelerates well but short shifts, I end up using the paddles for anything other than town driving.

Evora would only ever be manual even though I use it for the commute. Love the manual on the back roads. A decent DSG and real stop start commuting route might sway me a bit...

211 manual obviously. I can see the point of PDK's etc on track, just prefer the manual interaction, heel n' toe, lfb etc.

btw, Golf still the slowest car in the garage at 4.6s to 60.

[Mr Momo]

Previous Golf 7R was the 6spd DSG and I loved it in town in auto, for commuting. I loved it in manual/sport, especially out of town on my fave roads (B9119 ).

My new (photocopy) Golf 7.5R is the 7sp DSG and I’m just not getting the love from the 7sp. 7th in normal auto is way too high geared (35mph/1000), so I find myself overriding with the paddles - doesn’t make for smooth driving. Out of town is better (in sport/manual) but I’m still learning the 7speed. Most of its first 1000miles has been spend pounding the boring A90 up and down to Fife.

For me, DSG for everyday/allround motor (i.e. DSG on the Golf), but lighter manual on Lotus. The best gearbox was the 6sp on the Toxic Frog

[Mikie711]

Good grief, how many of us have Golf R's. Might need to rename the site if this keeps up.
In all seriousness though the Golf is a brilliant package and I like the 7 speed DSG although I do agree it does try to get into 7th as quick as possible in Eco or Normal and sport still holds the gear to long. But all in all it's a very good box and unlike the Audi isn't caught out easily.
The one thing the car has that I do detest with a passion is the collision avoidance, every time it goes off it scares the sh!t out of me and I nearly have a bloody accident. Stupid thing and not sure you can turn it off.

[Stevoraith]

The one criticism I have of the ZF 8spd is that it has too many gears for manual use.

When in auto mode the more gears the better I suppose and you don't notice it shuffling through them but when in manual mode you do have to keep an eye on the dash to know which gear you are in.

On a typical B-road I'll only use 4th, 5th and 6th which are probably the equivalent of 3rd & 4th in a traditional 6spd box.

[rossybee]

when in manual mode you do have to keep an eye on the dash to know which gear you are in.

I'd be more inclined to be keeping an eye on the engine revs - what gear you're in (especially when so closely stacked as they'll be in an 8spd box) is of less importance, kinda just a number....

[Rosssco]

when in manual mode you do have to keep an eye on the dash to know which gear you are in.

I'd be more inclined to be keeping an eye on the engine revs - what gear you're in (especially when so closely stacked as they'll be in an 8spd box) is of less importance, kinda just a number....

Yep, was driving 'spiritedly' last night in my BMW, and I really just wanted a manual 6-speed, primairly because I'd loose track of which gear I was in. Saying that, there is so much torque, it really doesn't matter too much - still pulls reasonably enough in 7th to make progress on most B-roads.. The main aim however is less to keep the engine near the upper rev range, but more to keep it down, as traction is a real issue.

[smoo25]

Every day car is a DSG Octavia Scout. Got it because was the only one available at the time in budget but I'm converted. For wafting to work it's perfect and can pop it into "manual" if I'm feeling like a hooligan on the way home. Would add tho that I'm getting crap mpg compared to my last manual same spec skoda.
For the fun car tho I can't imagine an auto of any form. Even got annoyed at the i30 N I had a shot in for auto blipping the throttle on the down change. I like to do that myself!

[Mr Momo]

Good grief, how many of us have Golf R's. Might need to rename the site if this keeps up.
In all seriousness though the Golf is a brilliant package and I like the 7 speed DSG although I do agree it does try to get into 7th as quick as possible in Eco or Normal and sport still holds the gear to long. But all in all it's a very good box and unlike the Audi isn't caught out easily.
The one thing the car has that I do detest with a passion is the collision avoidance, every time it goes off it scares the sh!t out of me and I nearly have a bloody accident. Stupid thing and not sure you can turn it off.

Ha ha, the collision avoidance does that to you ! Do you know it works in reverse also

[campbell]

Agree on mpg, Ali. Similar prob with the vRS.

I like how cruise can use all the gears though. 25-80 and no hands