serious engine problems!

[ian974]

Short story kept short, my car lunched its engine on monday, and have had it taken to a garage and been told that the best route to go with regards to repairing it is replacing the engine (damage to pistons visible, coolant flows to sump, not good!)
It's an s1 with what started as a standard 118hp engine. The head i think is a 135 hp head/cams upgrade of some sort but at the moment I'm not sure whether there is damage to valves or the head, though I wouldn't be too worried about going back to a standard top end.
What replacement engines would I be able to use? Will most 1.8 k's be suitable and simple for the garage as long as they are non VVC and have distributor ignition? (I'm going to check with a scrap yard tomorrow I think they have a few MGf/tfs) Would 135 cams swap over or would best bet be to flog em?
While the whole thing will need to come out I'll probably replace the clutch at the same time, guess a new timing belt/tensioner etc would be worthwhile on the replacement engine too so that it's a known age.
After only having a head gasket done in january, I am now learning to hate this car, and very tempted to sell once it's put right

[robin]

Sorry to hear about this.

Any non-VVC 1.8 is fine.

It doesn't matter if it's an EU3 engine (that's the later type with coil top ignition) as you can transplant the inlet cam + distributor drive from your engine to the new engine easily enough. This might be preferable as you're more likely to find a low mileage EU3 engine these days. Fitted to plenty of 2000-onwards Rover vehicles (e.g. Rover 75 1.8 as well as all the non-VVC MGF cars).

There are two common routes to 135bhp.

One is the Lotus 135 head which uses standard cams but has some porting done to improve airflow.

The other is to fit 135 cams.

If you've got 135 cams then you may as well leave the new engine in one piece (i.e. don't split the head from the block), pop the cam ladder off and install the cams from your engine. Only requires some cam ladder sealant and four new cam oil seals.

If you've got the ported head then you might want to consider moving the head to the new engine, though perhaps you don't care enough about the few BHP enough to warrant the cost of splitting off the head and fitting to new engine.

If your head is OK and you want to transplant then you can include VVC engines as the blocks are the same, only the heads are different.

Cheers,
Robin

[Mikie711]

A much easier solution rather than transplanting the distributor cap is to fit a 4 way coil pack from something like a saxo or vauxhall Eco tech engine. I did it with my engine and used the same lay out of the 340r. End up with no moving parts, no rotor arm or cap. I used a bosche motorsport coil pack and magnicore leads bit can be done for pennies rather than pounds.

[Stu160]

Hi ian

Automek on this forum has a good k which he has taken out his elise, may be worth a pm to him.

Best of luck

Stu

[OlberJ]

Automek is on here? The Baird?

[Sanjøy]

Engine deal to be done?

http://www.scottishelises.com/phpbb/vie ... =4&t=30275

[ian974]

Have sent a pm to automek, Will also check what else I can find, but all very useful information, cheers. Will update as it goes on.

[robin]

A much easier solution rather than transplanting the distributor cap is to fit a 4 way coil pack from something like a saxo or vauxhall Eco tech engine. I did it with my engine and used the same lay out of the 340r. End up with no moving parts, no rotor arm or cap. I used a bosche motorsport coil pack and magnicore leads bit can be done for pennies rather than pounds.

Where does the cam phase signal come from/go to in this setup? I.e. how does the coil pack know which cylinder to fire?

Cheers,
Robin

[ian974]

A much easier solution rather than transplanting the distributor cap is to fit a 4 way coil pack from something like a saxo or vauxhall Eco tech engine. I did it with my engine and used the same lay out of the 340r. End up with no moving parts, no rotor arm or cap. I used a bosche motorsport coil pack and magnicore leads bit can be done for pennies rather than pounds.

Where does the cam phase signal come from/go to in this setup? I.e. how does the coil pack know which cylinder to fire?

Cheers,
Robin

The majority of engines kicking about appear to be coilpack ignition, so how would this all connect up? I'll probably need to swap over the loom, but I don't understand how this would all fit. A saxo coil appears to have a 4 pin connection whereas the coil for the distributor k-series has a 2 pin connector I think? Is this essentially going to replace the coil with a different one where the plug leads connect directly to that rather than coil- distributor- leads?
I'm interested in what would be involved in this if it would be a simpler option than swapping about cams etc.

Cheers

[Mikie711]

A much easier solution rather than transplanting the distributor cap is to fit a 4 way coil pack from something like a saxo or vauxhall Eco tech engine. I did it with my engine and used the same lay out of the 340r. End up with no moving parts, no rotor arm or cap. I used a bosche motorsport coil pack and magnicore leads bit can be done for pennies rather than pounds.

Where does the cam phase signal come from/go to in this setup? I.e. how does the coil pack know which cylinder to fire?

Cheers,
Robin

Robin it doesn't. The pack is split and cylinders are fired in pairs and it uses wasted spark. Same as the later engines just with a cheaper to replace coil pack. Always found it strange why they used this set up on the 340r but not the other Elises.
Picture so you can see what I am talking about, you can even get the mounting bracket from Lotus.

[Shug]

A much easier solution rather than transplanting the distributor cap is to fit a 4 way coil pack from something like a saxo or vauxhall Eco tech engine. I did it with my engine and used the same lay out of the 340r. End up with no moving parts, no rotor arm or cap. I used a bosche motorsport coil pack and magnicore leads bit can be done for pennies rather than pounds.

Where does the cam phase signal come from/go to in this setup? I.e. how does the coil pack know which cylinder to fire?

Cheers,
Robin

Robin it doesn't. The pack is split and cylinders are fired in pairs and it uses wasted spark. Same as the later engines just with a cheaper to replace coil pack. Always found it strange why they used this set up on the 340r but not the other Elises.
Picture so you can see what I am talking about, you can even get the mounting bracket from Lotus.

My VVC fires wasted spark, but still needs a cam sensor to see when to fire each pair of coils. You saying you've done this without a cam sensor? The pic could use shrunk a bit

[roadboy]

Yeah, if you run "wasted spark" you have to run a can phase sensor so you can't run this setup on a standard S1.

You can stick any 1.8 K series in, regardless of ignition setup as the physical engines are all identical. If you get a later engine with plug top coil pack and you don't want to swap the cams, you can just get a rotor arm spigot to put in the inlet cam and run the dizzy cap setup. They're about 20 quid.

HTH

Dan

[KevD]

If you post on seloc you'll probably find someone selling one. Can probably ship it on a pallet for £50 in UK anyway.

http://classifieds.seloc.org/ads/vvc-k- ... gine-loom/
http://classifieds.seloc.org/ads/s1-vvc-conversion-kit/

I'm sure a saw a VVC engine on gumtree for £ 350 as well - http://www.gumtree.com/p/cars-vans-moto ... r/83843376

Someone else can advise how easy it would be to fit a VVC engine but I think it's wiring loom /ECU thats the issue?

[Shug]

Piece of the proverbial if you get one with the engine loom and ECU included. Would need to get the ECU recoded to your immobiliser (or bypass it) The engine loom just plugs in to the car loom where the normal K series would.

[KevD]

There's a loom and ECU available seperately as well - http://classifieds.seloc.org/ads/vvc-me ... ring-loom/