Solicitor advice.

[tut]

Who is our friendly Solicitor on here; is it Greg?

tut

[mac]

Greg or Graeme.


Hope it's nothing to troublesome!


Mac

[tut]

Just got the summons in for Luke, Court case on the 20th Sept. Could plead guilty and explain the circumstances, but think it would be better to go to court.

Two charges, the first that he was riding his scooter without L plates. He was not, he had the front one on and the rear one Khan had chewed the bottom end off, but it was still obviously an L plate with the _ missing. You could see the teeth marks. Chris explained to me that it counts as having no L plates on at all, if so how pathetic can you get.

The second charge was valid, he had his scooter on private land without permission as with his friends he had been camping there overnight. This is a field alongside Aden Park with a gate and turnstyle into it. Luke had camped with me there before with my car as it was the annual weekend motorbike jamboree in Old Deer, but for that we must have had the landowners permission, which Luke did not know about. Heinous crime.

The summons actually states that the police car drove by, saw the scooter in the field, parked up out of site, then waited till he drove it out of the field. Not even going to comment on that. Two sides to every story, but the above are the facts.

tut

[ClarkyBoy]

for driving stuff tut, greame murray and co. ask for greame himself, he is a real car nut, and managed to get my DD thrown out before i stood up!!!

01224897766

[Fluoxetine]

I'm completely cynical regarding the criminal justice system in modern Britain...

The key seems to be pleading poverty enough to gain legal aid - Then having your legal aid solicitor waste vast amounts of tax payers money, stalling the case till the PF gets bored and drops it...or they come up with the right deal, and you plead guilty to some lesser charge...

If you do have the funds, a decent specialist solicitor will do the above in a more timely fashion, and increase the liklihood of the case being thrown out...

When my car was stolen / written off a few years ago, the accused took the first option...For TWOC'ing / no license or insurance / no 'L' plates / being twice the drink drive limit / running from the scene of an accident, he got...

..... a £400 fine, and an 18 month ban (on his provisional), reduced to 14 months if he attended a 2 day course...

Rant over!

[tut]

Know how you feel Ross. This is so damned trivial, regardless of it being my own son, so why are they taking court time up with it?

I was pulled driving into Aberdeen recently with no front number plate on, and was told to get one on. How the hell does that compare with having a chewed up L plate on and being charged for it? ( Campbell and Chris's views more than welcome, as I say there are always two sides to the story)

tut

[ABZ-Elise]

If your son was caught dealing crack he would most likely get away with a slap on the wrist but because it has something to do with motoring they'll try the old

Kev.

[tut]

The sad thing is that you start loosing respect for the police, and that is not the way it should be.

tut

[Andy G]

shambles.

Was watching some car crime UK program the other night.

If you fancy a blast steal a car - a lot cheaper than running your own, and they do F*** all in court when you turn up, even better if you are under 16!

Do something when you own the car, bike etc, and my god you are going to pay for it - how the f*** does that work?

Courts need to start issuing some real fines for real crims, not trivial stuff.

[meatball]

Is it spelt ADVICE.......you are slipping boss!
Doubt there will be too much to worry about at court.......I would not plead guilty, I'd prefer to tell the story in court!

[tut]

Thanks Campbell. As he is 16, is he classed as an adult and can speak for himself, or could I represent him?

Conversely would it be worthwhile using a Solicitor?

tut

ps sorry about the heading, it should have course read "Solicitor advise me"

[meatball]

Greg etc will be better placed to advise you.....all I am saying is that I would not plead guilty in this case.
He can represent himself or can be represented by a solicitor.......I would always have a solicitor.

[kenny]

ps sorry about the heading, it should have course read "Solicitor advise me"

Of course it should

The sad thing is that you start loosing respect for the police, and that is not the way it should be.

tut

Losing, Tut.


Seriously though, hope everything goes well.

[tut]

Would not be without them Kenny, and I have always been fairly treated. However I have lived with them for a lot longer than the rest of you, and I suppose I would like to go back to the old style copper who walked or biked the beat and aspired to become a Patrol Driver in the Morris Minor 1000. Kids were different then and so was the relationship with the police. If you got caught scrumping or nicking a sweety from the corner shop you would get a good talking to from the boys in blue as opposed to an ASBO. You would never think of talking back to them, the same with your teachers.

But the world has changed along with the drugs, criminals, and gangs in it, plus the massive increase in roads, cars and their performance. I do respect the police as long as they treat me with the same respect. I had never been charged in my life,including fifty years of driving, until I picked up the points in the past two years, so I have no axe to grind. There are only three weeks to go for Ian to receive his summons in the post, and if it arrives he will be pleading guilty, but for Luke I will be fighting his corner as I do not believe that he deserved it.

tut

[Titanium S1 111S (gla)]

Tut,

This is well outside my area of expertise, I do civil commercial work. Greg may be in a slightly better position to advise than me since he has done some civil road traffic work but I don't think he has done any criminal work.

Firstly I would strongly advise Luke to speak to a Solicitor who deals with road traffic stuff regularly. He may be eligible for legal aid, if he is not then it is probably a case of the bank of Tut making an advance to be worked off on whatever basis. The law is a bit like flying a helicopter, you are likely to do more harm than good by “having a go” and Luke should do everything possible to avoid a criminal conviction even although the penalty is likely to be slight. Given the relatively trivial nature of the charges it may be that a Fiscal can be talked into dropping them by somebody who knows his / her way around.

As to the facts of the case, I don’t see why having a “puppy chewed” L Plate is the same as not having an L Plate at all. With all due respect to the police, their view is not what counts here it is a matter for the Court. I am willing to be corrected if there is authority to the contrary but I would have thought that if the L Plate was clearly visible and recognisable then the requirement to display it will have been met, in any event it is a perfectly reasonable argument to make. Do you still have the L Plate, it may be that it could be used in evidence. I have asked one of our trainees in the office to check up on the law of L Plates and will let you know if she turns up anything helpful.

I am slightly confused about what the second charge is, if Luke was riding his scooter on private land without the owners permission then clearly that is contrary to law but something being contrary to law is not the same as being a criminal offence. What exactly was the second charge?

Graham